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Differences between mail-mode and message-mode (was: message-mode is now
From: |
Reiner Steib |
Subject: |
Differences between mail-mode and message-mode (was: message-mode is now default?) |
Date: |
Sun, 19 Jul 2009 13:41:32 +0200 |
User-agent: |
Gnus/5.110011 (No Gnus v0.11) Emacs/22.1 (gnu/linux) |
On Sat, Jul 18 2009, Eli Zaretskii wrote:
> I had a few spare moments, so I compared mail-mode and message-mode.
> The differences I found are below.
>
> Disclaimers:
>
> Please note that I don't necessarily think all of them should be
> changed to match mail-mode, in order for message-mode to be
> compatible. But I do think they all need to be _considered_.
Thanks for your analysis. No matter in which direction a change will
go, this list will be a good basis for NEWS entries (either for
mail-mode or message-mode users).
> I also don't pretend to have found all the important differences,
> nor that all my conclusions below are correct.
> Finally, what's below is based on inspection of the *Help* buffer
> and defcustoms; I didn't actually try using message-mode, and
> don't know anything about it, except what I saw just now.
>
> Here's what I found:
[ key bindings ]
Obviously the key bindings cannot be resolved without a change for
either mail-mode or message-mode users. Maybe set the bindings
depending on some compatibility variable?
> . In mail-mode C-c C-f C-f moves to FCC; in message-mode C-c C-f C-f
> moves to Followup-To, and C-c C-f C-w moves to FCC.
>
> . In mail-mode C-c C-f C-a moves to Mail-Reply-To; in message-mode
> C-c C-f C-a runs the command
> `message-generate-unsubscribed-mail-followup-to' and there doesn't
> seem to be a command to move to Mail-Reply-To.
>
> . In mail-mode C-c C-f C-l moves to Mail-Followup-To; in message-mode
> C-c C-f C-m moves to Mail-Followup-To and C-c C-f C-l is undefined
>
> . In mail-mode C-c C-t moves to message text; in message-mode this is
> on C-c C-b, while C-c C-t runs `message-insert-to'.
>
> . In mail-mode C-c C-v runs `mail-sent-via'; in message-mode it runs
> `message-delete-not-region'.
What is "Sent-Via" about? Neither Google nor grepping through the
RFCs gave me any useful result. [1]
> . mail-mode runs `text-mode-hook' and `mail-mode-hook'; message-mode
> says it runs `message-mode-hook' "in addition to any hooks its
> parent mode `text-mode' might have run" -- it isn't clear to me if
> these two are compatible wrt what text-mode does.
This text is from `derived-mode-make-docstring'. message-mode is
derived from text-mode.
> . message-mode overrides the following global key bindings:
>
> - C-a runs `message-beginning-of-line'
This is somewhat similar to C-a in the minibuffer. If you want to
move beyond the mail header (e.g. "Subject: "), just press C-a again.
> - TAB runs `message-tab'
`message-tab' expand partially typed headers,
cf. `message-completion-alist'.
> - M-; runs `comment-region'
AFAICS, in mail-mode, `M-;' runs `comment-dwim', which first asks for
a comment syntax since none is defined.
> . message-mode's default value of `message-generate-new-buffers'
> seems to generate buffer names in a way that is different from what
> mail-mode does.
AFAICS, if I do `M-x message-mail RET', I get also get a "*mail*"
buffer.
> . message-mode's default value of `message-fill-column' overrides the
> global value of `fill-column'.
I used the recommendation from the relevant RFCs or GNKSA docs, IIRC.
Unlike `fill-column' which affects the user (and his co-workers, ...),
the fill column in mails (and news) should try to make sense for the
recipients.
> . mail-mode uses `mail-setup-hook'; message-mode uses
> `message-setup-hook'.
On Sat, Jul 18 2009, Miles Bader wrote:
| One issue, of course is hook names; would it work to simply have
| message-mode use the mail-mode hooks directly, and use variable-aliasing
| to accommodate people that use the message-foo-hook names?
Miles, is `defvaralias' what you have in mind?
@@ -905,12 +923,13 @@
(defcustom message-setup-hook nil
"Normal hook, run each time a new outgoing message is initialized.
The function `message-setup' runs this hook."
[...]
+(defvaralias 'mail-setup-hook 'message-setup-hook)
[...]
> . mail-mode uses `mail-yank-hooks'; message-mode doesn't appear to
> have such a facility.
,----
| ;; FIXME make it really obsolete.
| (defvar mail-yank-hooks nil
| "Obsolete hook for modifying a citation just inserted in the mail buffer.
| Each hook function can find the citation between (point) and (mark t).
| And each hook function should leave point and mark around the citation
| text as modified.
|
| This is a normal hook, misnamed for historical reasons.
| It is semi-obsolete and mail agents should no longer use it.")
`----
Should we care about it if is obsolete?
> . message-mode's default value of `message-citation-line-format'
> seems to produce different results compared to what `r' in Rmail
> produces.
AFAICS, `r' doesn't cite at all and produce not citation line (neither
does `C-c C-y' (`mail-yank-original').
> . message-mode's default values of `message-yank-cited-prefix' and
> `message-yank-empty-prefix' are different from the results produced
> by the default value of `mail-yank-prefix', and the names of the
> options are also different.
You mean the indentation? I think message mode's default are much
better.
> . message-mode's default value of `message-signature' is different
> from mail-mode's `mail-signature',
I think using ~/.signature by default is reasonable.
> and the names of the options are different.
See above -> Alias?
> . mail-mode uses `mail-signature-file'; message-mode uses
> `message-signature-file'.
See above -> Alias?
> . mail-mode uses `mail-default-directory' for auto-saving mail
> buffers; message-mode uses `message-auto-save-directory',
See above -> Alias?
> and the default values are also different.
message-mode tries to write all it's files under ~/Mail . Many users
like to sync their mail stuff between different computers.
message-mode's default makes this easier.
> . mail-mode uses `mail-mode-syntax-table'; message-mode uses
> `message-mode-syntax-table. The default values are also
> different.
I don't know why message mode additionally contains `>' and `<'.
message-mode also copies `text-mode-syntax-table'.
> . mail-mode uses `mail-send-hook'; message-mode uses
> `message-send-mail-hook' and `message-send-hook'.
See above -> Alias?
> . mail-mode's `mail-bury' tries to show the Rmail buffer if
> `mail-bury-selects-summary' is non-nil. message-mode's
> `message-bury' doesn't seem to have a comparable feature. (This is
> important when reading mail on a text terminal.)
Probably we should call code like `mail-bury' to `message-bury' if
`rmail-summary-buffer' is non-nil.
> . message-mode doesn't seem to have an equivalent of `mail-use-dsn'.
We could add the `mail-use-dsn' code to `message-send-mail-with-sendmail'.
Bye, Reiner.
[1] http://www.google.com/search?q=%2B"Sent-Via"+mail+header+rfc
$ dpkg -l 'doc-rfc-*'
[...]
ii doc-rfc-0001-0999 20030621-1 Other RFCs
ii doc-rfc-1000-1999 20030621-1 Other RFCs
ii doc-rfc-2000-2999 20030621-1 Other RFCs
ii doc-rfc-3000-3999 20030621-1 Other RFCs
ii doc-rfc-experimental 20030621-1 Experimental RFCs
ii doc-rfc-fyi-bcp 20030621-1 FYI and BCP RFCs
ii doc-rfc-misc 20030621-1 Miscellaneous RFCs
ii doc-rfc-old-std 20030621-1 Old Standard RFCs
ii doc-rfc-std 20030621-1 Standard RFCs
ii doc-rfc-std-proposed 20030621-1 Proposed Standard RFCs
/usr/share/doc/RFC$ zgrep -ie Sent-Via */*.txt.gz
/usr/share/doc/RFC$
--
,,,
(o o)
---ooO-(_)-Ooo--- | PGP key available | http://rsteib.home.pages.de/
- Re: message-mode is now default?, (continued)
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Chong Yidong, 2009/07/17
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Stefan Monnier, 2009/07/17
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Richard Stallman, 2009/07/17
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Miles Bader, 2009/07/17
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Bastien, 2009/07/18
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Byung-Hee HWANG, 2009/07/18
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Eli Zaretskii, 2009/07/18
- Differences between mail-mode and message-mode (was: message-mode is now default?),
Reiner Steib <=
- Re: Differences between mail-mode and message-mode, Sven Joachim, 2009/07/19
- Re: Differences between mail-mode and message-mode, Eli Zaretskii, 2009/07/19
- Re: Differences between mail-mode and message-mode, Eli Zaretskii, 2009/07/19
- Differences between mail-mode and message-mode (was: message-mode is now default?), Stephen J. Turnbull, 2009/07/22
- Re: Differences between mail-mode and message-mode, Reiner Steib, 2009/07/22
- Re: Differences between mail-mode and message-mode, Stephen J. Turnbull, 2009/07/22
- Re: Differences between mail-mode and message-mode, Miles Bader, 2009/07/23
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Stefan Monnier, 2009/07/18
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Eli Zaretskii, 2009/07/18
- Re: message-mode is now default?, Stephen J. Turnbull, 2009/07/18