Re: [Paparazzi-devel] question about paparazzi on sounding rocket

[Chris Gough]

On Wed, Feb 15, 2012 at 12:27 AM, Florin Mingireanu
<address@hidden> wrote:
> Does this imply that UAVdevboard and Ardupilot Mega are also under MTCR/ITAR
> or there is something special to paparazzi that places it under MTCR/ITAR?

I'm not aware of any reason why paparazzi hardware would be "a
dual-use good" and the other open source autopilots would not be.

But the assessment process is opaque. Maybe they just didn't like my shoes :)

Chris Gough

> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 3:22 PM, Chris Gough <address@hidden>
> wrote:
>>
>> > The best thing about open source software an hardware (at lease with
>> > GPL) is
>> > that it is outside of MTCR and ITAR restrictions.
>>
>> I have formal advice contradicting this from the Australian Defence
>> Department (Defence Export Control Office).
>>
>> Their technical assessment found that paparazzi autopilot hardware is
>> a "dual-use good" under MTCR. It took me ~9 months and >20 submissions
>> to get a license to export it.
>>
>> Don't piss them off, they have a big stick.
>>
>> Chris Gough
>>
>>
>>
>> > Cheers,
>> >
>> > Sent from my iPad mini.
>> >
>> > On 14/02/2012, at 11:58 PM, Florin Mingireanu
>> > <address@hidden> wrote:
>> >
>> > One way to do it is to not attempt any inertial correction during the
>> > burn.
>> > After the burn out roll/yaw/pitch stabilization can commence. You don't
>> > have
>> > a high g environment anymore. Also it helps if the rocket is inherently
>> > not
>> > planned to roll fast...
>> > In this case I could see that an open source autopilot (like paparazzi)
>> > could do the task of stabilizing the vehicle.
>> >
>> > Florin
>> >
>> > On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 2:56 PM, Bernard Davison
>> > <address@hidden>
>> > wrote:
>> >>
>> >> The nominal burn time for the motors is 0.8-1.25 seconds.
>> >> The 3" Sighter and the 5" Zuni motors have pretty similar burn times.
>> >>
>> >> We launch them at an angle of 70 degrees so they always land several
>> >> kms
>> >> away from us.
>> >> It also helps protect us when the student payloads break off. Which
>> >> happens from time to time with some of the designs.
>> >>
>> >> Cheers,
>> >> Bernie.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Sent from my iPad mini.
>> >>
>> >> On 14/02/2012, at 11:48 PM, Florin Mingireanu
>> >> <address@hidden> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> How long does the burn take? 2-3 seconds?
>> >>
>> >> Thanks,
>> >> Florin
>> >>
>> >> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 2:47 PM, Bernard Davison
>> >> <address@hidden>
>> >> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> The launch is >70G ;-)
>> >>> The thing goes from a compete standstill to >Mach 2 in 1 second.
>> >>>
>> >>> The rockets we usually use are surplus defense motors.
>> >>> http://www.asri.org.au/SSRP
>> >>>
>> >>> We did have a payload once that was going to try and maintain a lock
>> >>> throughout the flight but it got buried. :-(
>> >>>
>> >>> Cheers,
>> >>> Bernie.
>> >>>
>> >>> Sent from my iPad mini.
>> >>>
>> >>> On 14/02/2012, at 11:41 PM, Florin Mingireanu
>> >>> <address@hidden> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Hello,
>> >>>
>> >>> Why doesn't the GPS keep lock during the ascent? I have seen GPS data
>> >>> loggers for high power rocketry that keep lock during the ascent. What
>> >>> type
>> >>> of GPS module do you use?
>> >>>
>> >>> Best regards,
>> >>> Florin
>> >>>
>> >>> On Tue, Feb 14, 2012 at 2:38 PM, Bernard Davison
>> >>> <address@hidden> wrote:
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Yep standard civilian GPSs have been flown. They lose position of
>> >>>> course
>> >>>> at launch but do acquire solution after the main parachute opens.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Also the MEMS accelerometers have been flown and data logged.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> The major problem we've always faced is knowing what went wrong when
>> >>>> things don't work and the thing is buried 5m underground and the
>> >>>> rocket has
>> >>>> turned itself into metal confetti.
>> >>>> We've worked out what we believe  Will be a survivable data storage
>> >>>> module. Hopefully to be tested in the next year or so.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> At the moment were breaking the Lisa/L board up into smaller
>> >>>> components
>> >>>> and designing them to be rugged. I.e. positive locking connectors
>> >>>> isolation
>> >>>> on some switches and comms. Etc.
>> >>>> We're also breaking the board into discrete task based "nodes" that
>> >>>> can
>> >>>> communicate via redundant CAN bus connectors. So in the future it
>> >>>> would be
>> >>>> possible to have a failure tolerant system. I.e. if you have a
>> >>>> failure of a
>> >>>> transceiver node, IMU node, flight computer node, CAN bus. Then it
>> >>>> could use
>> >>>> another node on the network.
>> >>>> Of course that would need the appropriate software to be written for
>> >>>> that kind of control.
>> >>>>
>> >>>> Cheers,
>> >>>> Bernie.
>> >>>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> Paparazzi-devel mailing list
>> >>> address@hidden
>> >>> https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/paparazzi-devel
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
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>> >>> https://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/paparazzi-devel
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> Florin Mingireanu
>> >> Romanian Space Agency
>> >> Str. Mendeleev 21-25, et. 5, sector 1, 010362 Bucuresti, ROMANIA
>> >> office tel. +40-21-316.87.22; +40-21-316.87.23;
>> >> cell: +40-757-768971 (primary phone)
>> >> fax +40-21-312.88.04
>> >> address@hidden
>> >> http://www.rosa.ro
>> >>
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>> >>
>> >>
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>> >>
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > Florin Mingireanu
>> > Romanian Space Agency
>> > Str. Mendeleev 21-25, et. 5, sector 1, 010362 Bucuresti, ROMANIA
>> > office tel. +40-21-316.87.22; +40-21-316.87.23;
>> > cell: +40-757-768971 (primary phone)
>> > fax +40-21-312.88.04
>> > address@hidden
>> > http://www.rosa.ro
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
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>> > address@hidden
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>> >
>> >
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>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> .
>>
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>
>
>
>
> --
> Florin Mingireanu
> Romanian Space Agency
> Str. Mendeleev 21-25, et. 5, sector 1, 010362 Bucuresti, ROMANIA
> office tel. +40-21-316.87.22; +40-21-316.87.23;
> cell: +40-757-768971 (primary phone)
> fax +40-21-312.88.04
> address@hidden
> http://www.rosa.ro
>
> _______________________________________________
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