Re: [Fsuk-manchester] MFS Tor node

[Mark Reynolds]

I think the danger of running a exit node has been a bit exaggerated
here but would anyone object to the setting up of a relay or bridge
node with the bandwidth usage capped to a sensible level?

Also, using this for demonstrations and education sounds like a good
idea. It'll help raise awareness of the issues around censorship and
privacy and show how free software can make a difference in those
situations.


On 19 August 2010 09:10, Pete Morris <address@hidden> wrote:
> Tor exit nodes are a recipe for headache if ever there was one. If you want a 
> nice, quick, does-what-it-says-on-the-tin method of getting MadLab raided by 
> GMP on a regular basis and eventually shut down, a Tor exit node will suit 
> you down to the ground.
>
> Consider what an exit node is: it effectively acts as a proxy server for 
> people who don't want anyone to know what they are looking at. For every 
> freedom fighter you will find 100 warez and kiddie porn users. Trying to 
> prove that the exit node is not your personal traffic is down to you, and 
> although the EFF have a few interesting case-study letters to try and amuse 
> the authorities with, when you are sat in a cell you are unlikely to have 
> access to their website to download them.
>
> The only person I know who runs an exit node does so on a device that cannot 
> be traced to them. I investigated running one for a while in my early days 
> and was firmly advised to not touch it with a bargepole.
>
> This is a great shame, as in principle Tor is a superb idea, and obviously 
> there is a world wide shortage of high quality exit nodes (by that I mean 
> exit nodes that don't themselves packet sniff all traffic going through them 
> to try and fish out passwords). However, it's a bit of a no-win situation. To 
> run a high quality Tor exit node, you need:
> a) high levels of resources, such as bandwidth;
> b) high levels of guarantee that your own route between your ISP and "the 
> internet backbone" (if you'll excuse my poor metaphors) isn't contaminated by 
> government activity (being a top-level ISP such as BT helps);
> c) high levels of cash to pay off the authorities and/or enough legal or 
> corporal clout to get them to leave you alone.
>
> MadLab strikes me as being an organisation that doesn't have an excess of any 
> of those.
>
> Tor exit nodes are one of those ideas rather like joining the 
> BNP/EDL/UAF/<insert random extreme political group>, which whilst you are all 
> passioned-up about the cause seems the way forward ... but in the cold light 
> of day, you think to yourself, "actually I should have kept my head down :("
>
> Pete
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: address@hidden [mailto:address@hidden On Behalf Of Jon Spriggs
> Sent: 19 August 2010 00:30
> To: Mark Reynolds; Manchester Free Software
> Subject: Re: [Fsuk-manchester] MFS Tor node
>
> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> Hash: SHA256
>
> Running a bridge or an entry node seems like an OK idea, but running an exit 
> node is likely to cause problems for all the users at MadLab.
>
> As a fairly habitual attendee at MadLab, I think I'd prefer not to have the 
> internet feed overly used for this. That said, I agree with the use of Tor on 
> the whole, and I was considering running a tor exit node for a while, but on 
> a VPS rather than at, what is effectively a community centre.
>
> What would probably be a better idea would be to show how one would setup a 
> hidden service, how to use tor (as white noise to mask the people who *need* 
> to use it) and to let people make their own decisions about entry and exit 
> nodes.
>
> I'm more than happy to help give this as a talk at some point (but not until 
> at least November please! There's too many other events going on this month 
> and next, and I'd like to give my wife at least a relatively undisturbed 
> October!) That said, I'm sure there's likely to be some better informed about 
> services like Tor within MFS.
>
> "Mark Reynolds" <address@hidden> wrote:
>
>>What do people think of setting up a MFS Tor node in Mad Lab to show
>>in a practical way how free software can help foster freedoms? With
>>Internet censorship and recently the threat to secure communications
>>on Blackberrys by a number of countries and talk of a crack down on
>>Wikileaks privacy -enhancing software that helps protect whistle
>>blowers, human rights advocates, etc is more important than ever.
>>
>>As I'm sure you're aware this technology helps a lot of people in all
>>kinds of situations
>>https://www.torproject.org/torusers.html.en
>>makes interesting reading.
>>
>>There is a potential for abuse but this is fairly low anyway and the
>>exit policies can be configured with bandwidth limits and what
>>services to allow e.g. POP3, SSL, etc.
>>
>>In terms of the type of node bridges use less bandwidth and are
>>important in allowing people in countries with censored Internet to
>>get on the Tor network. Relays increase the speed of Tor overall and
>>exit nodes are always in demand.
>>https://www.torproject.org/faq.html.en#RelayOrBridge
>>
>>Hardware wise it could be run on an old donated computer. Assuming Mad
>>Lab or someone else would be willing to provide a home for it it
>>should be fairly straight-forward to setup.
>>
>>What are people's thoughts and opinions on this?
>>
>>--
>>"To win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the
>>highest skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the highest
>>skill."— Sun-Tzu
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>Fsuk-manchester mailing list
>>address@hidden
>>http://lists.nongnu.org/mailman/listinfo/fsuk-manchester
>
> - --
> Jon "The Nice Guy" Spriggs
> Sent from my mobile device, therefore, please excuse any typos or gramatical 
> errors.
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-- 
"To win one hundred victories in one hundred battles is not the
highest skill. To subdue the enemy without fighting is the highest
skill."— Sun-Tzu