Re: [Ranger-users] A new approach to build the user interface of the future!

[Andres MRM]

Unbelievers...
I find your lack of faith disturbing.


Quoting Gerald Klein (2015-04-01 09:39:01)
> I apologize but I won't be changing to Emacs bindings, why would I change from
> hitting one key to hitting many for the same result, explain why this is
> better, (that is sarcastic, it's not better)
> 
> On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 1:34 AM, Cédric Picard <address@hidden> wrote:
> 
>     That actually sounds pretty thoughtful. Being able to plug emacs
>     plugins in ranger, we won't have to go out of ranger for anything. We
>     will even be able to disable Ctrl+k and stop providing a way to go
>     out. That would a nice feature as it was proved that the more
>     difficult it is to exit a system, the easier it is to learn it
>     deeply.
> 
>     I can't wait to be able to browse the internet in ranger-browser
>     while listening to the ranger-music-player-daemon.
> 
>     However, Python isn't a GNU standard language so if we really want to
>     benefit from it I think that it is important to rewrite ranger in
>     lisp. Emacs lisp seems the best suited flavor for this.
> 
>     What do you think?
> 
>     On Wed, Apr 01, 2015 at 07:15:11AM +0200, Miodrag Milic wrote:
>     > Cedric dude
>     >
>     > Are you high or something ?? You have to focus ASAP. This is historic
>     > moment.
>     >
>     > Since we are now members of the Emacs church i think we should embrace
>     the
>     > new religion totally and let ranger implement elisp plugin system,
>     > compatible with emacs spec,  so that we can run some or all emacs 
> plugins
>     > within ranger. I know, its a non trivial task but we will help by
>     donating
>     > and styling documentation. What do you guys say  ? (dont say no, you 
> know
>     > its awesome)
>     > On Apr 1, 2015 2:37 AM, "Cédric Picard" <address@hidden> wrote:
>     >
>     > > Okay, let's be serious.
>     > > The great thing about this new release is that now we can use thoses
>     > > free keys to type, but to type what? Well, what's typed most often in
>     > > a file manager is a path.
>     > >
>     > > So let's think about it for a second: what if we typed nothing but
>     > > paths? It's common knowledge on Unix that everything is a file. I
>     > > think we might be able to pull something out of it.
>     > >
>     > > What I propose is to implement a ranger file system (rangerfs) that
>     > > will allow us to use our file systems more efficiently.
>     > >
>     > > Examples:
>     > >
>     > > Moving a file could be accessing:
>     > >
>     > > /tmp/ranger/move/+FILE+/home/cym13/file/+TO+/tmp/newFile
>     > >
>     > > Copy? Easy!
>     > >
>     > > /tmp/ranger/copy/+FILE+/home/cym13/file/+TO+/tmp/newFile
>     > >
>     > > Opening with a program with vim:
>     > >
>     > > /tmp/ranger/open/+WITH+/usr/bin/vim/+FILE+/home/cym13/file/
>     > >
>     > > With rifle:
>     > >
>     > > /tmp/ranger/open/+WITH+/usr/bin/rifle/+FILE+/home/cym13/file/
>     > >
>     > > Notice how useful it would be! And the best is that it would not be
>     > > limited to ranger as any program able to deal with files would be
>     > > able to use the full power of ranger!
>     > >
>     > > Honestly, don't you think it would be interesting?
>     > >
>     > > On Wed, Apr 01, 2015 at 02:04:02AM +0200, hut wrote:
>     > > > I have the feeling that you guys are pulling my leg.  It's a serious
>     > > > problem.  How about we use the free key bindings to add commands for
>     > > > navigation, file operations and other useful tasks?
>     > > >
>     > > > On Wed, Apr 01, 2015 at 01:29:09AM +0200, Miodrag Milic wrote:
>     > > > > >Hey Miodrag, got any idea what to do with all the keys that are
>     > > unused now?
>     > > > > YES.
>     > > > >
>     > > > > You should bind those to some great applications and sites needed
>     by
>     > > > > everyone like thunderbird, minecraft, facebook ...
>     > > > >
>     > > > > On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 1:16 AM, Cédric Picard <address@hidden>
>     > > wrote:
>     > > > >
>     > > > > > I think the least would be to print a big red warning message
>     > > > > > explaining why typing on a key alone should be deprecated.
>     > > > > >
>     > > > > > Or print an ascii punny per key. That could be fun. Like a
>     child's
>     > > > > > mode. « Son, when you are old enough, I'll teach you the Meta
>     key.
>     > > > > > Right now, play with the punnies. »
>     > > > > >
>     > > > > > On Wed, Apr 01, 2015 at 01:07:43AM +0200, hut wrote:
>     > > > > > > Hey Miodrag, got any idea what to do with all the keys that 
> are
>     > > unused
>     > > > > > now?
>     > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 01, 2015 at 12:54:02AM +0200, Miodrag Milic wrote:
>     > > > > > > > Nobody is being sarcastic here !
>     > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > The change is already well documented (great work hut as
>     always,
>     > > > > > cheers)
>     > > > > > > > RTFM and start testing ASAP, don't wait for free treatment,
>     just
>     > > buy
>     > > > > > some
>     > > > > > > > B6  <http://goo.gl/0Jxut7>and you are ready to go !
>     > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > On Wed, Apr 1, 2015 at 12:40 AM, Gerald Klein 
> <address@hidden>
>     > > wrote:
>     > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > What is the change?? Without the sarcasm
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 5:15 PM, feel.squally <
>     > > > > > address@hidden>
>     > > > > > > > > wrote:
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > >> With vim key bindings for scrolling down along the files
>     in a
>     > > > > > directory
>     > > > > > > > >> you just need one finger typing j.
>     > > > > > > > >>
>     > > > > > > > >> I guess with emacs you need C+n that implies TWO fingers.
>     > > > > > > > >>
>     > > > > > > > >> Also, if this change is about a concern of freedom, is
>     there
>     > > the
>     > > > > > FREEDOM
>     > > > > > > > >> to choose between vim and emacs key bindings like tmux
>     does?
>     > > > > > > > >> If so, I am happy with this change otherwise I think
>     ranger
>     > > will
>     > > > > > lose
>     > > > > > > > >> users pretty soon.
>     > > > > > > > >> Il 31/mar/2015 22:52 "Miodrag Milic" <
>     address@hidden>
>     > > ha
>     > > > > > > > >> scritto:
>     > > > > > > > >>
>     > > > > > > > >>> > Imagine a text editor where you can just type in some
>     > > keys, and
>     > > > > > they
>     > > > > > > > >>> appear on
>     > > > > > > > >>> the screen.  Just like that.
>     > > > > > > > >>>
>     > > > > > > > >>> OMG, I didn't even know such thing exists!!!! PLEASE!!!
>     > > > > > > > >>>
>     > > > > > > > >>> On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 10:41 PM, Gerald Klein <
>     > > address@hidden>
>     > > > > > wrote:
>     > > > > > > > >>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> Can someone please tell if this is a joke, I'm serious 
> I
>     > > can't
>     > > > > > tell?
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> On Tue, Mar 31, 2015 at 3:20 PM, hut <address@hidden> 
> wrote:
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> So, ranger has been around for almost 6 years, and
>     after
>     > > all
>     > > > > > this time
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> of
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> optimizing and re-evaluating, I think we need a
>     paradigm
>     > > shift
>     > > > > > in the
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> way
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> ranger works.
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> There are going to be a few changes starting with the
>     > > upcoming
>     > > > > > 1.7.0
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> release
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> which can be tested now already by running the current
>     git
>     > > > > > version:
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>   git clone https://github.com/hut/ranger.git -b
>     current
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>   cd ranger
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>   ./ranger.py
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> I sincerely believe now that trying to copy the vim
>     user
>     > > > > > experience
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> was wrong
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> on many levels, because clearly emacs is the better
>     > > editor.  It's
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> build on the
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> idea of freedom, of elegance and of having to press
>     > > modifier
>     > > > > > keys all
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> the time.
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> If that doesn't convince you yet, how about this:
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> Imagine a text editor where you can just type in some
>     > > keys, and
>     > > > > > they
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> appear on
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> the screen.  Just like that.  No silly modes, no crazy
>     > > things
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> happening by
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> typing random characters on the keyboard (think 
> ggdGZZ,
>     it
>     > > > > > deletes
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> your whole
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> text, then saves the file and quits the editor!  How
>     crazy
>     > > is
>     > > > > > that?!)
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> No.  Using Emacs key bindings is the only sane way to
>     do
>     > > it.
>     > > > > > Check
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> out the
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> new key bindings on the man page:
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> http://ranger.nongnu.org/ranger.1.html
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> Of course ranger has no concept of "typing in text"
>     like
>     > > emacs
>     > > > > > does,
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> so typing
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> in keys without modifiers will do nothing at all.
>     > > Basically you
>     > > > > > will
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> have to
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> use modifier keys for everything you do.  But still
>     it's
>     > > > > > obviously
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> better than
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> vim-like key bindings.  ***BONUS*** The first 100 to
>     > > upgrade
>     > > > > > will get
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> a free
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> treatment for their future carpal tunnel syndrome!
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> Regards,
>     > > > > > > > >>>>> hut
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> --
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> Gerald Klein DBA
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> address@hidden
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> www.geraldklein.com <http://geraldklein.com/>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> geraldklein.wordpress.com
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> address@hidden
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> 708-599-0352
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> Arch, Gentoo I3, Ranger & Vim the coding triple threat.
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> Linux registered user #548580
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>> Brought to you by the Amish Mafia
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>>
>     > > > > > > > >>>
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > --
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > Gerald Klein DBA
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > address@hidden
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > www.geraldklein.com <http://geraldklein.com/>
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > geraldklein.wordpress.com
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > address@hidden
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > 708-599-0352
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > Arch, Gentoo I3, Ranger & Vim the coding triple threat.
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > Linux registered user #548580
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > > Brought to you by the Amish Mafia
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > > > >
>     > > > > > >
>     > > > > >
>     > > > > > --
>     > > > > >
>     > > > > >       Cédric Picard
>     > > > > >
>     > > > > > « No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his
>     > > privacy,
>     > > > > > family, home or correspondence »  Art.12 Universal Declaration 
> of
>     > > Human
>     > > > > > Rights
>     > > > > >
>     > > > > >
>     > > >
>     > >
>     > > --
>     > >
>     > >       Cédric Picard
>     > >
>     > > « No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his 
> privacy,
>     > > family, home or correspondence »  Art.12 Universal Declaration of 
> Human
>     > > Rights
>     > >
>     > >
> 
>     --
> 
>           Cédric Picard
> 
>     « No one shall be subjected to arbitrary interference with his privacy,
>     family, home or correspondence »  Art.12 Universal Declaration of Human
>     Rights
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> --
> 
> Gerald Klein DBA
> 
> address@hidden
> 
> www.geraldklein.com
> 
> geraldklein.wordpress.com
> 
> address@hidden
> 
> 708-599-0352
> 
> 
> Arch, Gentoo I3, Ranger & Vim the coding triple threat.
> 
> Linux registered user #548580 
> 
> Brought to you by the Amish Mafia
>