Re: conflicts in the gnu project now affect guile

[Jean Louis]

* Thompson, David <address@hidden> [2019-10-16 10:12]:
> Now, onto the present.  Seeing Mark step down from as a Guile
> co-maintainer was an indicator that something was amiss internally
> with Guile.  I have a great respect for Mark, but I must admit that
> I've been extremely disappointed to see him, on internal GNU lists,
> steadfastly defending what I consider indefensible behavior by RMS.

What you need to understand is to keep GNU project apolitical, where
only politics is free software philosophy.

That is how "community" is created, on sharing what is common to
community.

We are all different people. We have all our different political
notes.

RMS has affinity to Science Fiction. Somebody does not have affinity
on Science Fiction and cannot think of it.

Would then Science Fiction as subject beyond free software shall be
focused on to divide the community of free software depending on what
they think of science fiction? Please understand the analogy.

GNU community is friendly to each other and welcoming everybody
regardless of their outside political viewpoints.

Keep GNU community politics-free and it will keep growing and
remaining friendly.

If somebody is defending RMS or attacking RMS -- why not keep that in
your personal conversation to RMS, or keep it on your own blogs. But
keep it OUTSIDE OF GNU website.

> Upon seeing the mail to this list that Mark was stepping back into his
> co-maintainer role, I had assumed that Andy and Mark had worked
> through their differences and disagreements and was glad.  But now
> that I know that the truth is that RMS, as chief nuisance, put Mark
> back into this role without the consent of either active Guile
> co-maintainer, and without even telling them, I am extremely
> disappointed and I do not approve.

Could you deflate accusations please?

> RMS, once again, has abused his leadership role to make unilateral
> decisions to the detriment of a GNU project.

He has acted, he has not "abused". If anybody shall be leader and
contributor in GNU project those should be people loyal to free
software philosophy and loyal to GNU kind communication guidelines,
people who understand that GNU project is about free software
operating system and users' rights.

People who think that GNU project itself shall favor one or the other
political views are in the wrong place.

Please find appropriate place for your ranting, be it on RMS, myself,
or anybody else. Not in GNU.

GNU is welcoming community to everybody.

It is apolitical.

It is non-partisan community.

Could you try understanding?

It is not a democracy and it never was. Free software philosophy was
not invented by democratic process.

> Yet another data point that reinforces my belief that when RMS
> "leads" the results are negative.

That is inflation of rumors without facts. What can be wrong that one
developer was welcomed back? Nothing.

What can be wrong with people like Ludovic Courtès and Andy Wingo and
other members of the Thoughtpolice Squad? Everyting. They are dividing
community, they do not belong in kind community.

I let them be. But I propose that they take their disgraceful
behaviour outside of GNU.

> This is not the behavior of ap leader that I support, and I
> certainly don't personally recognize him as the leader of GNU.

So what?

> He truly is a broken stair, a stick in the mud, a roadblock.

He is the roadblock for people like you who never hold free software
speeches and who value rumor mongering and false journalism more than
his works to promote free software philosophy.

Otherwise, he is the driving force and with all his connections, and
influence that RMS has, he can fart and cause more good in society
then you can with your biased fact-less statements.

> What happens if we pay no mind to him?  Does the GNU brand mean
> anything at this point?  If anything, it's probably negative.

Blah blah blah, impossible, you have no idea what you are speaking
about. Numerous free software organizations exists in his world, all
over the planet, they do not share your thoughts, and your opinions
simply do not matter. You cannot change the "GNU brand".

It is project to build operating system and project is successful and
accomplished, and there are many free software distributions, and free
software philosophy is influencing the world and politics of many
countries. Users are gaining their rights back. And there is much more
to fight for.

You cannot do nothing about it.

You can hate RMS as much as you want, but you cannot do nothing about
it.

Finally there are people who love RMS for his way of living, for his
way of pushing ideology forward, you cannot do nothing about that.

> As for the future, I would like to see Guile continue to be the
> welcoming, inclusive, productive place it has been since I've known
> it, even though it may require some socially difficult decisions.
> Andy and Ludovic, you have my support.  You've responded to recent
> events admirably even though it meant being personally attacked by
> others within GNU and outside.  Mark, I urge you to reconsider where
> you stand with RMS.  I know that you have a lot of history, but times
> have changed.

I see no reason why Guile could not be welcoming. It is now welcoming.

What is wrong is mixing other viewpoints that do not belong to Guile,
into the programming language.

Jean Louis