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Re: [Gnucap-devel] Verilog - was: Re: Use of M as suffix for Mega

From: al davis
Subject: Re: [Gnucap-devel] Verilog - was: Re: Use of M as suffix for Mega
Date: Tue, 5 Sep 2006 14:55:30 -0400
User-agent: KMail/1.9.4

On Thursday 24 August 2006 20:11, jbdavid wrote:
> 1. I'd strongly suggest perl or python as scripting languages
> for netlist translation..
> a friend of mine had once done a spice-spectre-Verilog-AMS
> netlist translator that
> used an internal XML table and XSLT transformations..
> everything in to XML database, then out to whichever format
> you wanted.. I can ask him if he'd be willing to contribute
> that.

I will take it no matter what language it is written in.

The reason I suggested awk is that for simple translations it is 
just a list of expressions to match and print statements to 
print them different.  For simple translations it is by far the 
simplest.  For complex translations, I would prefer a language 
more tuned to complex problems, like python.

There is a big difference in the style of these languages.  I 
find the idea of perl being a "super awk" a bit strange.  awk 
is a "logic" language.  perl is an "imperitive" language.  The 
programming style is completely different.  I think many of 
those who automatically recommend against awk are not 
comfortable with the logic style programming.

The classic logic language is prolog.  awk and make are also 
logic languages.

> 2. What is different about the cadence AMSDesigner is that
> the digital and analog are VERY closely integrated..  you can
> use both digital and analog constructs in the same module..
> Pretty sweet.. I'd like the same capability in a free tool,
> so I'm willing to help work on it..

I would like to know more about the user experience.  What is 
the command set like? etc...

> In fact after working with spectre (which at least had case
> sensitivity) I really want a simulator with Verilog syntax as
> the primary netlisting language..

So do I.

> IE a Joint icarus/gnucap build..

That is something to look into ,,  A big difference is that 
icarus is compiled, gnucap is interpreted.  Gnucap has the 
provision for attaching compiled models, which will become more 
automatic than it is.  By doing this, ultimately almost 
anything could be attached.

Also, I would like to look into adding analog to icarus..

> (but the XML idea keeps sticking in the back of my head

The XML idea keeps coming up, but really doesn't help much here. 
In this context, XML is just a syntax.  Everything else still 
needs to be defined.  Instead of XML, one might as well say to 
use a C-like syntax, an ADA like syntax, or a python like 
syntax.  The syntax is the easy part.  The meaning is the hard 
part.  That's why Verilog and VHDL are so attractive.

> too..) just tell me where the subversion code repository is
> and how to check out the code..

The best way for now is the development snapshots. The RCS 
archive is at .  I haven't figured 
out how to get clean web access.  I plan to migrate it over to 
CVS or something newer, but have been swamped with other stuff.

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