Re: [Fsuk-manchester] Trisqel, Debian, and non-free fir mware (was: Any folks in Manchester interested in p articipating in an Ubuntu Global Jam event if I were to organise one?)

[Bob Ham]

On 2013-02-20 16:03, Simon Ward wrote:
> On Wed, Feb 20, 2013 at 02:15:30PM +0000, MJ Ray wrote:
> > > If an installer does not offer the possibility of installing some
> > > non-free firmware, is it "concealing" that non-free firmware from 
> > the
> > > user?  Or is it respecting the user's desire to not be offered an
> > > invitation to the choking world of proprietary software?
> >
> > Nice straw man.  Debian's installer has to have a firmware loader
> > anyway (some firmware is free software) and so any fully-working
> > installer must "offer the possibility" else it would not be free
> > software.  Some makes it harder than others.
>
> Free software firmware could be provided on the installation media or 
> in
> the repository, and does not need to load it from elsewhere.

I think this is getting very far from the point.  The word "concealing" 
implies some kind of deceit on the part of the distribution maker, as 
though they are doing something bad.

However, this view depends on the user *wanting* to be subjected to 
questions about installing non-free firmware.  I'm pointing out the fact 
that this is an assumption; there are users who definitely do *not* want 
to be subjected to such questions.


The issue then comes down to what the distribution maker intends to 
provide; a free software operating system, or an operating system that 
subjects users to questions about non-free firmware.  If the intent is 
to provide a free software operating system then omitting an offer to 
install non-free firmware isn't "concealing" anything, it's respecting 
the user's wishes.

I'm not completely sure what the intention is within the Debian 
community on this particular point.  I could be wrong but I actually get 
the impression that the Debian community itself isn't completely sure 
what the intention is within the Debian community.


--
Bob Ham <address@hidden>

for (;;) { ++pancakes; }