Re: Icicles stealing keybindings

[Marcin Borkowski]

On 2015-01-03, at 03:17, Drew Adams <drew.adams@oracle.com> wrote:

> See the Icicles doc, section ... (wait for it) ... `Key Bindings'.

OK, understood.  I'll do my homework next time.

Now the question is: where is the manual?  I hit C-h i m Icicles RET and
nothing happens.  I know of no other places to look for manuals...  (ESR
would get heart attack.)

Now, kidding aside: I use EmacsWiki as "the docs"; is there any better
(e.g., offline) place?  (What you write below is not necessarily better
for me, though I can live with it.)  What would be great for me would be
e.g. the docs in epub/mobi format, or at least a HTML file or a set of
files, so that I can put it on my kindle and read while commuting.  (In
a pinch, a PDF would do, too.)

> Hit `M-?' from the minibuffer, then click the link `[Icicles Doc,
> Part 2]'.  If Emacs Wiki were not down currently then I would
> point you also to http://www.emacswiki.org/Icicles_-_Key_Bindings
> (I think that's the URL).

Wow.  I did what you wrote here, and found myself in a strange place
called *Finder-package*.  I did C-h m, then jumped to the source file
for that strange mode (C-h m told me that it was about package docs) and
found out, that it was written by ESR himself.  I don't know what to
make of it now...

>> Of course, if Org-mode uses C-c ', it's Org-mode's fault (AFAIK,
>> newer versions of Org change some of the keybindings, but I'm not
>> sure exactly), since (AFAIK, again) it is reserved for minor modes.
>
> Yes, `C-c '' is reserved for minor modes.  But you can still have
> a conflict among different minor modes for keys like that one.

Of course.

> It is trivial to remove that binding for Icicles or to assign a
> different binding.  Again: option `icicle-top-level-key-bindings'.

Great, I didn't know about this option.

>> What got me a bit angry, after finally installing Emacs 25, is
>> that Icicles steals C-x SPC.
>
> Don't get angry before you read the doc. ;-)

;-)

> Actually, it was vanilla Emacs 24.4 that "stole" key `C-x SPC'.
> It was undefined until then.  Icicles has bound it by default
> since 2007.  Anyway, again: `icicle-top-level-key-bindings'.

"Mom, it wasn't me!  It was he who did it!" ;-)

But of course, you're right.

>> Now obviously I'm aware that you can change all keybindings,
>> including Icicles' ones;
>
> I think you'll find that it is particularly easy to change
> Icicles key bindings.  (You don't even need to know Lisp.)

Lisp is no problem, I speak (Emacs) Lisp on, say, something like
intermediate level.

> Start with the doc, section `Key Bindings', so you get an idea
> what key-binding options are available. The only one you need
> for top-level keys is `icicle-top-level-key-bindings'.
>
>> ... reasonable solution of the conflicting keys problem, so
>> that I don't have to reinvent the wheel?
>
> You don't have to reinvent anything.  You just need to decide
> what works for you.  Different people use different libraries
> that might lead to different key conflicts.  And different
> people have different preferences wrt keys.  It's up to you
> what bindings you use.

Obviously.  I just thought someone had some experience.  There are bad
keybindings, good ones and better ones.  I didn't want to use inferior
ones.  And Icicles is so huge, I even don't know exactly what I need
(since I don't know what's out there).

>> (Also, now that I use Icicles, I do not understand why would
>> anyone use Ido.  But that's another story.)
>
> Again, different folks can have different needs and different
> preferences. ;-)
>
> Sorry for your trouble.  Please spend a few minutes with
> `Key Bindings' in the doc, and I think you might feel better.

It's not you who should be sorry.  (Though I miss an Info manual,
frankly speaking.  They are so good.  It's not that they are old and bad
and browsers are new and good.  It's that browsers are not yet at this
technological level as the Info reader. ;-))

Thanks,

-- 
Marcin Borkowski
http://octd.wmi.amu.edu.pl/en/Marcin_Borkowski
Faculty of Mathematics and Computer Science
Adam Mickiewicz University