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Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out
From: |
Lee Sau Dan |
Subject: |
Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out |
Date: |
04 Feb 2002 14:24:27 +0100 |
User-agent: |
Gnus/5.0808 (Gnus v5.8.8) Emacs/20.7 |
>>>>> "Dan" == Dan Jacobson <jidanni@deadspam.com> writes:
Dan> I do
Dan> $ lynx -dump
http://www.geocities.com/Tokyo/Pagoda/3847/sapienti/hagfa99b.htm
Dan> > hagfa99b.txt
Dan> $ emacs -q hagfa99b.txt I go into options>mule
Dan> and the choice to set coding system is blanked out... what's
Dan> worse, its keystroke isn't even mentioned in the menu.
What? I tried what you do. No problem, except that I have to tell
Emacs that this file is in BIG5 encoding. You can do that with C-x
RET c chinese-big5 RET C-x C-f hagfa99b.txt RET. I see what is
expected in traditional Chinese characters.
Dan> Anyway, at this point the user would just see his data
Dan> garbled, with no pointers on what to do next.
Computers are not very clever. They can't reliably tell English from
French.
Dan> [I then did M-! cat hagfa99b.txt and can then at least see
Dan> what I'm supposed to see [big5 chinese], but then don't
Dan> expect that I can save and then see the file again
Dan> correctly.]
Something wrong with the coding systems setting. Have you M-x
set-language-environment? Apparently, your process-coding-system is
correct, because the M-! output is decoded using
process-coding-system's value.
For reading a file, Emacs could only make a guess about the coding
system. Since the file you gave started with a short section of ASCII
only text, and over half of the file contents are ASCII only, what
would you expect the smartest multi-lingual editor to do? Remember
what Knuth says: Computers are good at following instructions, but not
reading your mind. You're more intelligent that the computer, and
hence you know it's Big5-encoded. The computer is stupid and fails to
discover this. So, it needs your help: C-x RET c chinese-big5 RET.
Dan> This brings up the point: if the file is 99% big5, then why
Dan> not allow me to still handle it as 100% big5 if I
Dan> want...
But the file you gave was not 99% big5. It's less than 50%. Over
half of it is ASCII. (Well... yes, ASCII is a subset of big5, but I'm
talking about big5-only characters here.) I think Emacs is correct
here not to conclude that the file is in big5. It could be in other
encodings as well.
In your file, most of the lines look lie:
yong1 央 yong1 氧 yong1 養 yong1 癢 yong1 盎
in which 25 bytes are ASCII and 10 bytes are BIG5-specific. I'm
ignoring whitespaces here. 10 out of (10+25) is just 28.6%. This is
a typical line from your file. So, the actual figure should be around
this, and a rough upper bound is, IMO, 30%. That's still far from
50%. How come you claim it's 99% big5? "big5-specific", I mean.
Dan> Why can't emacs be told "I live in big5 land.
Have you already set-language-environment?
Dan> Sometimes I
Dan> have a giant file with one or two chars in it that cause
Dan> emacs to doubt that it is a big5 file.
If you're sure it is a big5-encode file, use C-x RET c ...
Dan> but I can't easily
Dan> because you think you are smarter than me and wont show it to
Dan> me in big5 mode, no matter what buttons i press".
No, Emacs thinks its more stupid than you. So, instead of making a
wild guess that a file containing only 30% of big5-only bytes is a
big5-encoded file, it behaves conservatively. And since Emacs knows
its stupid, it allows you to override its stupid decision: C-x RET c
chinese-big5 RET C-x C-f hagfa99b.txt RET.
--
Lee Sau Dan 李守敦(Big5) ~{@nJX6X~}(HZ)
E-mail: danlee@informatik.uni-freiburg.de
Home page: http://www.informatik.uni-freiburg.de/~danlee
- coding-system perfectionism locks user out, Dan Jacobson, 2002/02/04
- Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out,
Lee Sau Dan <=
- Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out, Dan Jacobson, 2002/02/09
- Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out, Eli Zaretskii, 2002/02/10
- Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out, Luis Fernandes, 2002/02/14
- Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out, Eli Zaretskii, 2002/02/14
- Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out, Richard Stallman, 2002/02/15
- Re: coding-system perfectionism locks user out, Eli Zaretskii, 2002/02/16